Quote from Boris Lozac :

LOL, wtf? great commercial! They are making jokes about their pace, officialy??

GO Kubica, GO GO GO!

Yes they are

Everyone is talking here in Spain about the R28 beeing slower than a Megane and at least they show some humor

Quote from Linsen :

Was Alonso? As far as I remember, Alonso himself was the only source for that piece of information.

I now i am gonna regret posting this but, what the hell!

Well, here in Spain many pple thinks that McLaren was favouring Hamilton.

We have to believe either Dennis or Alonso. Many pple has forget that when the spy scandal showed in Hungary Denis claimen that was only an issue of the spaniards (and coulghan) and noone else in the team had any idea about that.

Months passes at it seems that (from my point of view) Dennis has shown that he lied (or he just didn´t have any idea, but i find it extrangely unbeleivable :razz

So when Dennis says that both drivers had the same chances everyone over here just has a hard time believing him

Anyway, it´s not a matter of actively sabotagin FA´s car or something similar... but as FA said it´s impossible to have equity between drivers, there is always a better engine, a better stopping lap, a better chassis to choose and he felt the support was going into Hamilton.

I just hope my post don´t get converted in a fight between FA and HAM fans, just wanted to give another point of view.

I am one of those who think that McLaren´s plan was to support FA to get the title the first year, but the result´s from HAM were so good that at some point they changed their mind.

Just to give you guys a hint of how hard were relationships with the team, just remember that practically from the begining he wasn´t able to have a dinner with his mechanics, share the prices with them (which is usual at motorsports) and his family couldnt see the races from the McLaren box and they used to go to.... renault´s box, were everything was much more friendly. Not the same treatment as HAM´s Dad had

Yes, I now i am going to regret this post

I´ve never done that, but if it´s worth for something I use a program called "joytokey" that takes joystick inputs and convert them into key strokes. Don´t know if it can handle axes and that kind of stuff.

Quote from RocksGt :

The same thing is happening with Hamilton's words after Malaysian GP when he said "I could do with a beer" about the pit stop. Spanish press sold it as he was blaming his team for incompetents

I was thinking just in that quote when i said that translations are soo good for manipulation

BTW, looks like you use forocoches.com also with that roto2 logo

Quote from Linsen :

Personally, I don't think so. If you know how sports journalism works, you know that there's no such thing as an innocent statement regarding these things. There's always an intention behind everything you say. And I'm sure Alonso is enough of a pro to know how what he says will be received. So, it's a threat to Renault. And not his first one, tbh. He's said before that he'll be gone at the end of the season if the car is not compatible. Whether this is a wise strategy to put so much pressure on your own team or if it's detrimental to the athmosphere, I don't know, but it's certainly making Renault look sort of stupid in the public image.

Edit: that was to ATic Atac's post.

I see what you mean, but the quote was taken from an interview made from a soccer magazine.

I have read all the interview and the sense you get reading the original is that the journalist is trying to get a headline by making statement after stament to see if he picks something.

Basically all started due to The Times translating wrongly.... i really believe that sport journalists love having to translate to a different any other language as you can manipule it so easily.

Well, i have managed to get my hands on the original interview in spanish. It says like this:

"¿No es la escudería Ferrari el destino lógico, el mejor piloto llevando el mejor coche?

Yo siempre intento estar en el mejor coche. Ahora estoy en Renault porque ya triunfamos en 2005 y 2006 y quiero volver a lograrlo. Si no es este año, que sea el que viene. Pero cuando exista la opción de marcharme intentaré estar en el mejor coche posible, y está claro que Ferrari es uno de los mejores."

Now let me translate in my way:

"Isn´t it Ferrari the logical destination, the better pilot driving the better car? (this is spanish press, so of course alonso is the better driver )

I always try to be in the better car. Now i am at Renault because we won in 2005 and 2006 and i want to do i again. If it´s not this year, then the next. But when i have the chance of leaving i will try to be in the better possible car, and it´s clear that Ferrari is one of the best."

I mean, don´t you guys think this quote has gone out of proportion

Quote from tristancliffe :

I have a room to rent

LOL

Maybe it´ll be cheaper to get a satellite antenna at home

I swear that if you guys manage to see F1 without adverts, with the top gear team presenting and in HD i move to england

Quote from tristancliffe :

Yes. But compensated with an earlier apex and earlier throttle. Elapsed time will be greater (reduced overall grip), but compared to the car they're following they'll be better off.

It's completely obvious to anyone with sense that removing driving aids HELPS overtaking.

That have sense in a slow corner, but on the fast corners you cannot get even close to the car in front as you lose too much downforce.

So if you drive along a fast part of a circuit you have to separate a little from the car in front (0.5 sec o so) and when you get to a slower part of the circuit you have to recover that time to try the overtake.... pretty hard stuff IMO.

Quote from deggis :

Less grippy tyres? I think especially now without TC the cars in a desperate need of slicks.

http://f1.automoto365.com/news ... ewsForm&news_id=28599

Here's the 2009 proposal made last year. I couldn't find a more reliable looking link. That site looks a bit odd.

Bottom line; from proposal to actual regulation is a long way in FIA...

I heard Pedro de la Rosa explaining that new rules. He said that 50% less downforce is too much and that the final loss will be more like a 30%.

Tristan is right about the level of the drivers. Overtaking in F1 is and will be hard, but let´s hope that 2009 will make it a little bit easier.

Quote from Hyperactive :

The best and really the only way to pass someone in F1 is to wait for the person in front of you to make a mistake. Get the tail out a bit or miss braking point. The likelyness of an error is now much bigger than it was before with traction control/etc. that nannied you and prevented any mistakes from the driver. Sure, driving right somene is hard in F1 but not impossible. With the lesser electronics we might see more errors from drivers at Monaco, maybe we even see a pass (1) in Monaco this year

All I can tell is that getting rid of all that fancy electronics will cause more passing opportunities because of more driving errors. Massa certainly is suffering. Also lot of drivers make mistakes during the race when in 2007 it was an "event" when someone "lost it".

Just make the cars less aero dependant with harder, less grippy tires and the driving skills of the drivers will shine through the equipment.

I agree that now it´s easier to overtake someone due to mistakes. But i miss the normal overtakings. If you have a slower car in front of you after exiting pits you are doomed

Anyway the plan´s for 2009 go right in the direction you point. Less downforce and more mechanical grip. And the possibility of having a variable front wing to help following another car!

Quote from tristancliffe :

No, he was right.

For some reason I've gone insane and can't do basic reading of names. However, I think I've removed the bits that didn't actually make sense. Thanks Sam. I suspect I was reading a post from who I wanted it to be by, rather than who it WAS by, partly because I was tricked by the full quoting of my post.

LOL Tristan, i´ve been making a long replay and i found you have corrected your answer!!

I was quoting you, but i´ve edited it as is seems that you were answering the wrong person

About the lack of overtaking and the effect of the ban of TC, I think i am making a valid point.

Aerodinamics are more important this year due to the frozen of engines and tyres. Cars are more critical every year when following another racer as the turbulences affect more (i´ve heard this from many pilots)

Why the lack of driving aids should simplify the driving when chasing another car? Logic says that without TC and engine reduction control things are more complicated for the pilot and dont help at all when following another car.

I´ll put an example.... in Malaysia, except for the first lap, how many clean overtakings do you remenber? I mean, not caused by errors, pit stops, etc. And malaysia is a circuit were is possible to overtake, is wide, has nice braking areas, etc.

Hamilton was a lot of laps following webber with a faster car and he had no chance of overtaking. He just couldnt even try! And don´t tell me Ham is a coward or a bad driver, last year he would have tried to attack, but now its almost imposible to follow a car closely whithout getting in problems.

Last edited by ATic ATac, Mon, 24 Mar 2008 11:58.

Quote from tristancliffe :

Clownpaint - you should know better.

Advice - NEVER EVER LISTEN TO ANYTHING MARK BLUNDELL SAYS - HE IS A CLASS A FOOL

Engine Braking cannot be removed. It is an integral part of internal combustion gasoline engines.

What has been outlawed, through the use of common ECUs, is Engine Braking REDUCTION, whereby the throttle was applied to counteract rear wheel braking torque, and avoid lock ups. I believe some of the systems were also variable brake bias too (but I don't believe that source, and I can't remember where I heard it).

Engine braking is alive and well, and is one of the hardest things to cope with in an F1 car. It will be in F1 for as long as IC engines are, although possibly disguised by future nanny-aids introduced to allow poor drivers (like Massa) relative success.

I've trying to explain that to some of my friends and i had to surrender. Now i just nood when someone says there is no engine braking this year as everyone is happy.


Overtaking is now even harder than before. You cannot rely en the TC when you get turbulences from the car in front so most cars will be a chase down to see who makes a mistake first..... well monaco can be pretty interesting this year.

Superb driving from kimi. Kov and Trulli (looked good that toyota) made a good race without mistakes and Hamilton was screwed up by the failure in pits. He was in a podium position for sure.

If massa didn´t have mechanical problems in the accident, then it was a rookie mistake and you cannot do that kind of mistakes if you want to be a WDC contender.

Didn´t anyone notice the pass of heidfiel over Alonso and DC at the same time and the way Alonso took the last coner to pass DC himself. One of the best moments of the season so far.

Quote from gezmoor :

Then I stand corrected.

Probably one of the reasons that motorsport helmets are illegal for use when riding a motorcycle, as well as not providing the same level of protection (apparently).

They are just different helmets for different uses.

Motorbike helmets must have largar apertures due to the different positions your head has during riding. When liying over the tank you are looking practically up and you still need enough angle in the helmet to look at the speedo.

Motorsport helmets (F1 for example) are designed for maximun protection of a seated driver with a small vision angle and so the apertures are just rydicously small.... and thx to that you also have more space for sponsors

It´s official.

http://www.hondaracingf1.com/l ... tem_id=2041&year=2007

I hope honda will perform better..... well, on second thought, it´s impossible to perform worse

Quote from keiran :

What you’re describing is no different to what it's probably like in any other country. In the UK we have had to endure with Button mania for years and now Hamilton has come along they've totally forgotten about Button. I'd say it's even worse now because now they're behind a driver who is doing well so it's practically the `ITV Lewis Hamilton show`...

The worst thing is it has brought a lot more spectators to the sport who are only watching it because an English driver is doing well. I can't help but laugh at some of the conversations I hear customers at work having, a lot really have no idea. One firmly believed that Lewis Hamilton's car had been `turned down` so Alonso could beat him...

Lol, you are describing just the same that has happened in Spain in the last years. Spanish TV is completely biased towards Alonso and lot´s of new fans have arrived to F1 without having any idea of racing. They are pretty used to football and think F1 is just the same (the famous Alonsomaniacs)

Anyway, I´ve seen some ideas from English guys that are wrong. Lot´s of pple says that Alonso asked the team to have a better car than lewis and that Hamilton had to let him pass.

That´s just not true. Alonso has been asking just two things: Not to share his telemetry with Hamilton and that he can make his own tactics. Basically he didn’t want Lewis copying him when they were rivals for the title.

I know Alonso has been whining a lot this year, but the truth is things were so bad that his family and friends were watching the last races from the Renault box. It´s easy to say that Ron gave them the same car but, honestly, it´s hard to see Alonso´s mechanics working with the same passion as Lewis one´s.

I just want to point something. McLaren has lost one of the best guys setting up the car and next year the will have $100 mm less to develop the car due to the fine. Maybe (this is my opinion) Ferrari will have a easier year than they think.

Quote from Becky Rose :

Lewis wasnt bitter about the move Alonso put on him, he was bitter about Alonso full stop, Alonso's Hungary blackmail cost the team 100 million dollars and their championship points, all because Alonso wanted Lewis made the No. 2.

Lewis was just making a point, and quite ironical at that, in highlighting that Alonso is always moaning about those kind of passes. Fair play to Lewis, he had a go and it didnt work out but he didnt stuff the car into a wall or anything.

A few comments about that:

- Alonso just said he doesnt want lewis to copy his sets and doesnt want him to know his tactics. They may be teammates but the are fighting for the world title. He newer said he wanted something better than Hamilton or getting him backed up.

- Nobody in the F1 business believes that the fine was due to the mail´s. There were hundreds of mails, sms, etc between the engineers. Thinking that the result of all the info exchange were 3 mails between drivers is madness. Remember that Alonso didnt even believe the info about the weight distribution of the Ferrari. Everyone at McLaren knew about that, or at least the designers and the guys from the wind tunnel.

- Mails were sent FROM Pedro TO Alonso. Curiously, Pedro is probably gonna drive for Prodrive next year.... extrange reward for some1 that was passing secret info. Basically Pedro said "it´s my fault, i got the info from Coulthgan and passed it to Fernando, but noone else knew it". Basically he inmolated himself in exchange for a seat in F1.

Anyway, Dennis has accomplish a great goal. He has infuriated pple both in Britain and in Spain

Quote from Belain :

Maybe its because Mclaren Mercedes was driving with a McFerrari chassis? ^^

Lol, maybe some improvement cames from there

The truth is that having a reliable pilot in your team motivates a lot. If you have a top rider like Alonso, Schumi, Hamilton, etc. you know that with a decent car they can win races, so everyone makes harder efforts.

There was a phrase from a McLaren engineer at the beginning of season: “I`ve learnt more about car settings in an afternoon with Alonso than in a year with Kimi”

So let´s be serious. Alonso is a genious, but looks like Hamilton is another one.

Quote from tristancliffe :

Lose face maybe, but it's where a driver of his abilites belongs in my opinion.

It's only fair to make comparisons to a drivers teammate. Hamilton isn't bad, but neither is he a great (yet). And yet the ROOKIE is better than Alonso. I think Spyker might be a good team for him.

Like I've said before - Alonso, the most overrated world champion EVER

Well, he won Michael Schumacher twice, so according to that Schumy would be the most overrated 7 times world champion ever -lol, jk-

Anyway, consider that Alonso won with a renault, with a much smaller budget than ferrari and McLaren. Then he arrives to McLaren - team with a few years without winning - and suddenly both of their cars are at the top of the championship.... and renault goes back to the middle of the grid

That says something in favour of Alonso

Quote from deggis :

If anyone has happened to read FIA rules book, please explain what "excluding" or "banning" means. I think that makes absolutely no sense to let them race but get no points. It doesn't feel like real punishment.

Team´s get money at the end of the year according to the position in the constructors championship.

If you take mclaren points, you are punishing them with $80 million more or less..... i mean, that hurts

From autosport

The World Motor Sport Council has yet to agree on a final verdict, despite our earlier newsflash suggesting otherwise.

Sources have told autosport.com one of the options currently reviewed is to exclude McLaren from both the 2007 and 2008 championship - in line with the World Motor Sport Council's decision in July.

However the FIA said no decision has yet been made, although a verdict is expected imminently.

Quote from Takumi_lfs :

So it means that there is still any Hope?

Good job

Let´s say that chances of getting something have risen from 0,02% to 0,06%

I got news from Ascari! The events manager recived the mail and he tells me it has been resent to the marketing director to take a look at it.

According to a logo in the message, Ascari has now the "Five Star Diamond Award" in his hotel. God, that must be heaven for petrolheads

No answer to the mail yet. I will keep you informed if there are any news.